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Afraid Of A Change

Discussion in 'Server Discussion' started by BannableName, May 30, 2020.

  1. Lately I have been seeing many ideas that could possibly benefit the server getting turned down because it is thought that people might not like a certain change but I will explain why this is wrong. It's very hard to see it happening without even thinking the several possibilities of those ideas. If new stuff isn't going to be tried out then we will never know whats good and what people like. Being afraid of a change is a cost of losing a chance.
    What do you guys think? Should the server be open to changes or not?

    EDIT: This thread wasn't meant to start anything negative so please don't misunderstand it the whole point is to talk about what's happening and what the rest of the community thinks on this in a friendly manner.
     
    Posted May 30, 2020,
    Last edited May 31, 2020
  2. We are open to changes, which is why we have an ideas section and a correlating ideas team. We’re not afraid of changes, if an idea was declined, it’s because it was discussed and determined that it wouldn’t be a valued use of time/resources, or overall wouldn’t benefit the server enough to be implemented. You touch on the topic that we need “new stuff”, however, just because it’s new, doesn’t mean it’s good or it would be well received amongst the community, which is for Ideas Team to decide. If you want to see new “chances” implemented, you’re free to apply for ideas team when applications open.
     
    Posted May 30, 2020
  3. Time and resources don't just appear from thin air. The thing is if work is put into getting time and resources then those ideas can be implemented causing the server more success. Time & Resources are required for a minecraft server to be ran of this size.
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted May 30, 2020
  4. I never said we didn’t have time nor resources, I said an idea would be rejected because it wasn’t worth the aforementioned, and if it’s not worth it, then I can assure you we won’t be putting our efforts into it, and we’ll focus on something that’s actually worth our time.
     
    Posted May 30, 2020
    Johnny Welamton likes this.
  5. That isn't quite correct. Ideas Team themselves don't decide whether or not an idea should be accepted or denied. We get that information from LT/production for general ideas and Games Insight for game-specific ideas. We are just the messengers that put the ideas on a trello board for people to discuss/decide whether the idea should be accepted or not, and then write that response on the thread. We discuss and give our opinions on ideas, yes, but we do not make the final decision on them at all.

    Could you give me some examples of these ideas that you think shouldn't be denied? I can then perhaps go through them in more detail and shed more light on why they were denied, or perhaps we could reconsider them. IT is all about being open with the community and listening to you, so if people think we are too hastily denying ideas then we should listen to you and have more discussion about them.
     
    Posted May 30, 2020
  6. Just because the idea was denied, doesn't mean it won't be implemented. IT doesn't necessarily have a say in what's implemented or not. Look at some of the recent updates. Immortal was loads of denied ideas, but still was implemented. Area 51 raid game was denied, but still happened. /report for all players was denied, but was implemented today. The problem isn't what's being denied, it's that IT and Design need to work together more and be on the same page.
     
    Posted May 30, 2020
  7. I do remember some for example suggestions about more maps getting added, solo gamemodes in a few games instead of having to play with a party etc etc. If you scroll into the ideas section you can see several ideas that could possibly benefit the server and ideas that players will like but they get rejected for the same reasons like " It will split the player bases if a change in gamemodes is added" and "It isn't worth it" when it really is. Those few updates could make huge, huge changes and seeing them getting rejected for the same reasons is sad.
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted May 31, 2020
  8. That's the main reason this thread was made. Stuff that are shown as not important to the eyes of the devs and the ideas team are actually really important and players post several threads about them.
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted May 31, 2020
  9. I don’t think revolutionary ideas are a bad thing, if anything, now is the time to experiment, but there are reasons beyond being “afraid of change” that constitute an idea being denied. Read and understand why certain threads are shut down, there’s always sense behind each rejection and though I am one for change, I agree with a lot of the decisions. I believe changes are necessary, especially revolutionary ones, yet it’s hard to come by the right ones. Mineplex’s time and resources are valuable and are not as ample as they ideally should be for a large network, so They have to act accordingly. Mineplex needs to allocate resources where most necessary, and I believe they’re trying their best to determine where those places are right now.
     
    Posted May 31, 2020,
    Last edited May 31, 2020
  10. Hey!

    I think there is some truth in what you have said in the fact that some simple quality of life changes that don't really have negatives are sometimes overlooked. However, I am reasonably pleased with the direction the team has been taking in recent times. With the addition of the new website a couple years ago I definitely feel like more ideas are being discussed and/or processed or at least it is made more clear if ideas are being considered for implementation.
    It is definitely more user friendly and I have seen more ideas being discussed between the community and the staff team and some ideas are often assured if they are in some kind of developmental stage. I feel like the server is heading in a strong direction in terms of transparency and accepting community input. As others have said its important to have priorities straight to ensure the most important changes such as bug fixes are being implemented before other lower priority tasks to ensure that resources are being used wisely to benefit players' experience. Just because an idea is potentially appears to be overlooked doesn't mean it isn't noted or considered for the future and I think that has become quite evident and I feel Mineplex has come some way with that over the last couple years.
     
    Posted May 31, 2020
  11. I'm aware that Mineplex is a bit low on resources though the ideas could be maybe saved. I mean the ones that might be good at least. Throwing them out of the window completely isn't as good. They can just be worked on when time is given.
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted May 31, 2020
  12. If an idea is turned down by pretty much every single staff member and some others for the same reasons it means it's not going to be implemented. Don't get me wrong, mineplex listens to the community on balances and stuff but there are just some things that need to be noted or implemented because they have true potential.
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted May 31, 2020
    Meami likes this.
  13. I agree with you but of course there is then some kind of credible reason why multiple might people disagree with some suggestions. However, I do agree with you and think some ideas are turned away because of simply how low priority they might be, which is unfortunate because there are plenty of solid ideas that are thrown around that are seemly put aside, but like the others said ideas have been implemented further down the line that were initially dismissed. I just think credit should be given where it is due and I do think regarding this subject Mineplex has improved quite significantly in the time I have been around. Community sub-team implementations and the level of discussion of ideas on the site has all improved/contributed to some updates on the server.
     
    Posted May 31, 2020
    BannableName likes this.
  14. There could be a lot said on this topic, but I'm preparing a thread that will tackle a part of it anyway so I'm keeping it short. In my opinion, the way suggestions are processed on the forums needs to be more transparent and effective, because the forums as a platform isn't right now. If there is a thread that sees discussion happen for a few days or weeks at most, it should be forwarded to a member of higher staff, like CoM for server / community related ideas and Wanderer / Marzie / whoever is in charge of forum ideas right now, to summarise why the idea will or will not be added and update the thread status. I know it currently works pretty similarly, but the situation right now is that ideas still take time to go through, with their implementation rather questionable. If it was streamlined similar to the staff recruiting process, the trust in the server and the staff team by the community will increase (even if most of the staff team don't actually have a lot of influence, they still represent the server for most of the community).
     
    Posted May 31, 2020
    WowCaleb and Xukuwu like this.
  15. Suggestions (not all as some are reviewed, accepted and implemented and others are in-depth discussion) are not the biggest gamechangers for the servers. While a lot of the ideas are nice to think about, they don't offer the largest alterations to the servers in the entire world. Though it would be lovely for every cool sounding idea to be implemented that requires a lot of work and the process needs to be practical first and foremost. Therefore, ideas have to be processed and looked at in terms of priority and how crucial a solution to something could be. Though I do agree, I wish sometimes the changes being made to the server that have been submitted by a community member are more transparent. I have seen some people suggest things that were accepted and months/weeks later not much extra light has been shed on it's release date/ if the change is still even due to be put in place . It would also be nice to know if another project meant that dev time was being taken up so the community could hold that in mind when pushing for ideas to be put in place. I know every team works hard but it would be nice for the changes to be more open with the Mineplex community.

    This is not really something developers/owners have much say in so i don't know if I really works in this sense. Maps are worked on and tested each week and only the best aesthetically and for gameplay are pushed onto the server. New maps are always under review and updated bi-weekly sometimes monthly.
     
    Posted May 31, 2020
    Thenorn and Xukuwu like this.
  16. This has nothing to do with ideas on the forums. Maps are constantly being made by the builders, and as far as I know, they're allowed to build whatever map they choose, and are not forced to make maps for specific games. That's for the best, because although some games might not get as many maps made for them as others, if the builders were forced to make maps for games equally, they might end up making bad maps because they don't have a good idea for what to make.

    These two are somewhat related so I'll include them together.

    By "solo gamemode", I assume you are talking about a solo Cake Wars mode? The reasoning behind that being denied is, as you say, that it would split the playerbase. That's a valid concern and a completely legitimate reason for denying an idea. Yes, adding more gamemodes is always cool, but if in doing so you mean that everyone who wants to play Cake Wars has to wait so much longer to get into the game because there are the same number of people spread across three gamemodes instead of just two, it may not be worth it. Duo mode already struggles to fill up at times, and so I daresay that adding another mode might just kill duos entirely, save for peak hours on weekends and such. Now, you might be thinking that the best course of action would be to replace duo mode with solo mode, and a lot of people would agree with that. There was a poll in the MPD back in March for that suggestion, and it currently stands at 443 for yes and 155 for no.

    However, adding extra mode for Cake Wars is a lot easier than for other games, as Cake Wars is the most popular game and it already has a fairly unpopular mode that could easily be replaced. Other games don't have the same luxuries. Therefore, adding more gamemodes would absolutely split the playerbase. In off-peak hours, most games only get between 1-3 lobbies going at once. Splitting those games into two would either mean that a lot of the time, there is no lobby going, or you would constantly be playing with the same people, which in some games (and if there's someone who's really good playing) would make it rather dull.

    The benefits of adding a new gamemode also have to outweigh the negatives. I've denied about three "duo Master Builders" threads over the last month. Maybe these are the threads you saw in the Ideas section? They're denied because although BLD gets quite a lot of players and it might be viable to add another gamemode to it, moderating in duo games would be so much harder. It would be difficult for staff to tell which person on a team built something inappropriate, which would decrease the quality of games since people could get away with a lot more things than they could in the solo mode. Players could also very easily get onto a team with someone random and just troll them for the entire game. There are many issues like this that makes a duo Master Builders gamemode unappealing.

    I can assure you that that would never be the full denial reason. There would be more reasoning for why an idea was denied past that it just "isn't worth it".
     
    Posted Jun 1, 2020
    zlxr (Suspici0us) and WowCaleb like this.
  17. I assume you are talking about inspiration and that the builders wouldn't be inspired if they "got pressured to make builds in games they don't want to" but that's not how it should go. With that logic let's leave the same maps for 3 years without any changes because the builders don't have any ideas. If bad maps were added then the community would give feedback and they would be fixed/removed depends at least. It's all about listening to the community too.

    Regarding the player bases even if they were split then it would be something new. Cake wars has an average of 350 players on playing it. Why not let people decide what they want to play instead of forcing them to play duo or standard?

    For other games, I understand there aren't enough people but for cake wars, it could be done.

    Now for the last topic, I can't say much as I'm not in the ideas team, etc but I saw many people turning them down for that reason.

    I might sound a bit stubborn right now but I rather address the actual issues instead of playing blind eyes it's for the best.
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted Jun 1, 2020
  18. There are several games that have been left without maps updates for a while. Even if the maps that are going to be added are going to be "bad" the community will play on them and see what's going on to figure it out. The maps don't need to be paintings just maps that suit the game you play on with correct spots and a good area like the rest of the maps. Maps play a big part of keep a player in the game. I personally don't know how to build that well but for the builders that do figuring out a map idea isn't as hard.
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted Jun 1, 2020
  19. If maps are so important to keeping players in the game, then the best quality should always be encouraged. A good map can really make or break a game, especially as the map is what creates balance and unique gameplay for every gamemode. That is why not every map can just be put straight into the server as there are so many elements that go into determining whether or not it is a good map. There takes so much more to a map then just making it look good which is why there is a whole process to putting them onto the server.

    That is a bit of an emphasis ;-;. Last month there was 2 map updates in the span on 4 days one of the 20/4 and one on the 24/4. Games like sneaky assassins and SSM saw a new map, which isn't too common for those gamemodes, so there was variation being seen.

    I don't think it should be up to the community to determine whether or not a map is unbalanced or bad whilst actually trying to play it. If it is bad, that game will just be frustrating and will reflect worse on MP than waiting an extra few days to get an update of maps that have been tested to ensure already they are up to par. :)
     
    Posted Jun 1, 2020
  20. I didn't mean to make whatever I just meant that there is no need to make whole "painting-like" maps.

    Why did you leave my whole reply out? I clearly said it as a scenario. I didn't say that games right now are left with no map updates for 3 years.

    I didn't say to completely leave it up to the community but as the community plays a big role in balances etc etc by giving feedback on the forums then the feedback from the community on maps does matter.
     
    OP OP
    OP OP Posted Jun 1, 2020

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