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Frosting kit too op.

Discussion in 'Cake Wars' started by whistenote, Aug 18, 2019.

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  1. So my opinion on frosting kit is usually bad, I think that because frosting has 2.5 or 3 seconds (i cant remember) of slowness which makes it really hard for people to play especially people that are new, some people call them "bots" and lets say you were bridging and the other person threw a snowball at you and didn't manage to clutch it your basically dead meat, and also i've had experiences when people who used frosting said "ez" or "bot" which really ruins your temptation to play.
    Honestly i think frosting kit should be buffed

    --- Post updated ---
    I mean debuff*
     
    Posted Aug 18, 2019
  2. Personally, I don't have an issue with Frosting Kit. First of all, it is an Achievement Kit. This means that unlocking it requires a lot of work, skill and dedication, and I believe players who manage to achieve it should be properly rewarded. Secondly, the snowballs can be very easily avoided. This can be done by properly strafing or by placing blocks, in addition to a few other methods. Finally, I know for a fact that toxic players (who might say "ez" or "bot" after getting a kill) are not exclusively Frosting users, and I think it would be a huge generalization to say that. If someone is being toxic to the point where you no longer feel safe, respected, and motivated to play, feel free to report them for General Rudeness with /report (Hero+) or on the forums at www.mineplex.com/reports!
     
    Posted Aug 18, 2019
    whistenote likes this.
  3. Heyo! Starting off, there has already been a lot of suggestions related to this. Some other threads that have already been created like this can be found HERE:
    https://www.mineplex.com/threads/frosting-class-balance-issues.29819/
    https://www.mineplex.com/threads/cake-wars-frosting-kit.33055/
    (also, if a player was disobeying the rules, you can report them with /report in game, www.mineplex.com/report and make a forums report, or /chatsnap with Titan+)

    Now, on to my thoughts. While I believe frosting kit deserves a nerf, I think it has already been nerfed enough. It would be nice to see more balancing between the kits, but instead of nerfing the Frosting kit, other kits should be buffed instead. While sometimes it is overpowered to get comboed by snowballs, there are many ways to counter this. One way you can counter it is by using the kit yourself, if you have it. Another way you can avoid this is by using a bow, hiding behind blocks, making them waste their snowballs and waiting till they have none, or a speed potion.

    The only nerf I see happening soon to the Frosting kit would probably just be Slowness II to Slowness I. As of now, the kit is fine as it is, just more kits should be buffed instead. I hope this reply helped!
     
    Posted Aug 18, 2019
  4. Frosting kit has been nerfed before. each kit has its own strengths. Archer kit gets unlimited arrows which are good for bowing, the warrior kit is good for killing multiple people with one life, and builder for rushing and suffocating people with knitted platform. Frosting definitely is a very good combo starter, but it still takes skill to use. If another player kits you with frosting it's not like you can't beat them anymore. People with frosting are generally more skilled in the first place and it's not like its impossible to dodge. I disagree frosting should be nerfed again.
     
    Posted Aug 20, 2019
  5. Of course, even though I usually play on MP I opt out of the server when wanting to play a game like this so...
     
    Posted Aug 20, 2019
  6. I would also like to state how this thread now has at least 6 exact duplicates, see here:

    https://www.mineplex.com/threads/nerfing-frosting.56589/#post-220454
    https://www.mineplex.com/threads/nerfing-removing-frosting.52449/
    https://www.mineplex.com/threads/a-way-to-nerf-frosting.42035/
    https://www.mineplex.com/threads/remove-snowballs-from-cake-wars.34587/
    https://www.mineplex.com/threads/cake-wars-frosting-kit.33055/
    https://www.mineplex.com/threads/frosting-class-balance-issues.29819/page-2#post-103929

    While the idea of changing the frosting kit hasn't been denied per se, it also hasn't gained a lot of traction. If you have read through all 6 previous threads and feel you still have new content to add or a new argument or a better nerf, you may continue with your thread, but I assume most every argument has been brought up in either the original post or a reply post on one of these 6 threads.

    I'd also like to paste part of my response to one of the previous threads as well;
    Overall, this idea is not unique and has failed to gain a lot of support even through multiple previous threads about the same topic.
     
    Posted Aug 21, 2019
    FiveCPS and Apollo317 like this.
  7. If you get hit once, your reach is halved. People queue with this because it is the best cakewars kit, and it should be nerfed
     
    Posted Aug 23, 2019
    Jango_55 likes this.
  8. "Best" is definitely a matter of opinion. I personally have all the achievements, have access to the kit, and actively avoid using it in-game because it's not the best for me.

    Even if it was the best, it should be since it is difficult to earn. The list of achievements for Cake Wars is one of the longest, if not the longest list of achievements necessary to get an achievement kit in any game. This reason alone is not enough to warrant the need to nerf it.
     
    Posted Aug 23, 2019
    FiveCPS likes this.
  9. The point is that it negates skill with cheap slow mechanics that newer players don't have access to
     
    Posted Aug 23, 2019
  10. Newer players have access to strategies to dodge the snowballs and counter this kit. Newer players never have access to achievement kits but that doesn't mean they can't still win. Strategies for countering Frosting kit are found on the other threads I linked in my first response.
     
    Posted Aug 23, 2019
    FiveCPS and Apollo317 like this.
  11. Ah, my phone didn't show links, will check once I'm on PC and respond
     
    Posted Aug 23, 2019
  12. I personally do think the frosting kit is strong but wouldn't go as far of saying it is OP. While going against any kits on the server you will need to develop techniques to combat these kits. Also Goudge made a great point of saying it is an achievement kit and players put in a lot of work for the kit. Any kit can be seen as "OP" if the user is very advanced with using it. I've seen archers who were great with their bows same with insanely good trappers using the builder kit. Overall I don't think the kit is "OP". Thank you for bring this conversation up because I'm sure many others feel this way as well!
     
    Posted Aug 24, 2019
  13. Every kit does have it's advantages, I think that this kit is by far the best although, you could argue about the fact that the kit has it's counters, but realistically new players cannot counter this, I've tried every single kit to try and counter frosting, and I keep getting destroyed. I win almost every encounter in regular fights but when fighting the snowballs someone could have the worst gear, be new at the game, and I wouldn't be able to hit them. The kit does require skill though, that's where the balance is. Personally I think it's just annoying when the person is saying 'L' 'Easy' and things like that, whilst killing you over and over again. I can't fight this kit, I try to get them on bridges because that's where they are most vulnerable. I am grinding for this kit to test it for myself. I just fear that the best players will use this kit and completely destroy everyone including new players
     
    Posted Sep 6, 2019
  14. Don't mind me, just going through some bad arguments.

    Achievement kits should be balanced, not an unfair reward.


    A bow costs 12 bricks, and 3 arrows cost 12 bricks.

    If you are not archer, you just have spent 24 bricks. That's almost full iron armor + sword for frosting vs your bow.

    If you are archer, you've spent 12 bricks. That's still iron pants and an iron sword.

    Doesn't sound like a viable solution, you have to eventually challenge them, and then you can get comboed by snowballs.

    And frosting's strenght, to win almost any 1v1, is overpowered compared to other kit's strenghts.

    Isn't it quite obvious that there is an issue if it keeps coming up constantly?

    It's not necessarily about balance. Frosting is not a fun kit to play against. Having an opponent who has a combo tool when you don't have any feels unfair.
     
    Posted Sep 6, 2019
    jjzdragon, leo_thya and JMPhase like this.
  15. I cannot stress this enough, but unlocking the achievement kit rewards a new playstyle, not a kit that is stronger than the other ones. All kits should be balanced, and the achievement kit is no exception.

    I see a lot people use player skill to justify whether a kit is good or not; by using that logic, all kits are balanced, by that’s definitely not true (just look at SSM). Player skill doesn’t define if a kit is good or not, but the kit itself. That’s why you should always look at the kits potential and what it can do, not what a player can’t/can do with a kit.
     
    Posted Sep 6, 2019
    Segwat, neropatti and jjzdragon like this.
  16. Although I do agree with you, it's only to a certain extent, you are right in what you say but that kit can make an average player, turn into an amazing player. No other kit can do that. This kit, in the hands of an already good player, is unstoppable except from on bridges.
     
    Posted Sep 6, 2019
  17. Frosting isn't that great. It's not that hard to dodge the snowballs, because literally 97% of all Frosting users, always throw them in a similar predictable pattern and even if you manage to get hit by one of those bad boys, you can either = run away or face them, which isn't too difficult IF you have a decent CPS. :)

    They could, maybe slower the rate in which the snowballs spawn, but that's it. It's an achievement kit and it is supposed to be superior to the other kits, anyways: anyone can get it.

    This is besides the point, but not beside the topic, as you were complaining about people calling you "noob" or "bot" or other dumb gaming insults, you seriously should not give a damn about comments like that. People writing such things are just self-reflecting the fact that they think that their lives suck in the chat. Mineplex also provides tools for you to save yourself from such toxicity like /ignore (command).
     
    Posted Sep 6, 2019
  18. The frosting kit was already available when I first started playing Cake Wars, if I recall correctly.
    Through grinding, though, I was able to get it myself, and by the time I got it, I was already good enough at aiming to be able to use it effectively.

    If you feel demotivated because of the influx of frosting users, just know that, while it does take a while, you eventually will get it too, if you keep at it for long enough.

    I believe in you! :D
     
    Posted Sep 6, 2019
  19. My point with frosting is as follows:

    Yes I use frosting but I also go against people who use frosting. WIth frosting their is a huge skill gap because there are total bots who think hitting u with it once is equal to an instant win and there are people who know how to combo frosting and strafing to have an unstoppable combo. If a player requests me in game to 1v1 them without frosting I will happily oblige. The only time I use frosting to sweat is when I am against other professional players.

    In conclusion:

    Frosting is only op if you use it correctly
     
    Posted Sep 6, 2019
  20. "It's an Achievement kit, I believe players that have gotten this far deserve a worthy reward"
    Oh boy, you all do not know how SSM is...
     
    Posted Sep 7, 2019

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